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A new idea for Radio Control from Australia - Maybe
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 Posted: Fri Sep 4th, 2009 01:42 am
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W C Greene
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Mark-since you have seen the train run across a table without any track, I will concede that this gent has it down. I run without any track wiring and do use Li-Po rechargables due to the larger than HO (1:32) locomotives and heavy ore cars which are run half the time with a full load of "ore" up and down vicious grades so I need some power. I am getting about 6-8 hours of run time per charge with average 7.4 volts and 1200 MAH. Like my buddy Herb, I like to run with a stick transmitter and there are none offered for model rr use so we use old r/c car xmitters and run with the Kyosho boards. It is great to know that others are using what we consider the future of the hobby, I look forward to more advances. Keep us posted on what's happening in your part of the world.           Woodie



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 Posted: Fri Sep 4th, 2009 03:40 pm
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Herb Kephart
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Woodie-

I have seen your comment about the wheel/rail contact area to not be enough for recharging before. Talking through my nether extremities right now, I think that started with the guru guys that you work with- but remember that they are trying to recharge quickly to get back in the air, or on the track- so that the amperage that they are charging is far more than you or I use. The wheel to rail electrical connection can either perfect, or less than perfect to some extent- if less than- the voltage will still be there, the amperage will be cut down- resulting in a longer than expected charging time.

I think that Mark is is right- I have  couple of electric locos that each unit has two old K&D #1's (not R/C) that pull 4 amps running and wheel contact on code 100 rail is not a problem.

OK refute away-----


Herbie:old dude:
 



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 Posted: Tue Oct 20th, 2009 11:03 pm
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Burra
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Hello all,
 If you come across the new NWSL 'Stanton' Drive, it is the SPUD that the author of the articles this thread is about has designed in conjunction with NWSL, that he uses with his radio control. The units run very well, better than the Hanazono, Tenshodo, PDT and Black Beetle SPUDs in my opinion, and are wired ready to be used with DCC/RCC or what have you.
 I'd link to the NWSL website but its useless. Best I can do is this from my works' blog:
http://bergshobbies.blogspot.com/search/label/Stanton%20Drive
 Cheers,
 Mark



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Hi, my name is Mark and I am a trainaholic...
Modelling Tasmanian 2' gauge at the speed of continental drift.
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 Posted: Wed Oct 21st, 2009 01:30 am
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W C Greene
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OK Herb, as for your post way back in October about charging circuits through the wheels. Yes, it would be possible to do this with the low amperage we need BUT then you will have wired track and pickups on the loco's wheels. The charge goes through the rails..OK, then it goes from the wheels through extremely small and sensitive pickups and then on to you know where. Maybe your big old O scale locos would have "robust" wheel wipers, but wipers on most smaller models and those without metal frames, etc. are prone to lose contect and wear out quickly if you do any long time operations. Brass locos don't need fiddly pickups, the drivers and tender trucks route power to the motor in a satisfactory manner, some "split frame" HO & N locos have shed the pickups but many still have some form of wipers that make (or break) contact and power the motor. Most of the repairs I do concern pickups that are worn out or not making contact or just plain dirty. Others may love wheel/track power interface, but I think it is an antique way of doing business.

But then, it's my opinion, and opinions are like a..........., everybody has one. I won't leave my name here because I am afraid of the dcc police. Hasta la Vista.



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 Posted: Wed Oct 21st, 2009 02:17 pm
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mopman
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So, if you are recharging the battery through the rails and wheels, how do you isolate the r/c board from the battery while recharging.  It is my understanding that during a recharge, the r/c board must be isolated from the battery to eliminate possible damage to the board.



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 Posted: Wed Oct 21st, 2009 02:49 pm
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Herb Kephart
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Jim- I don't isolate the board while charging, and haven't had any problems (YET!)

While I have not tried charging from the track, and really dont have a way of doing this, since all my wheels are grounded, I think that it could be done this way--

Put AC to the track, and have a diode bridge in the loco. Doing this will eliminate the problem of reversed (DC) polarity if the loco is turned around. Switches, crossings would be isolated, and electrically dead so the loco would only pick up charge current when on plain sections of track. If the pickup was intermittent (dirty track) no problem, just no charge for that instant. When the loco came to a switch, there would be no charge, but the battery could not short, or try to back feed the track because the diode bridge would prevent it. I envision the use of a 9V NiMH battery, because of the charging of LiPo's is time and voltage critical. No need for a lot of on board battery capacity, as some, or most likely all the power to the motor is coming from the track. Just brainstorming about this. It might even be possible to use coin cell batteries, if there are any that are rechargeable--all the battery needed would be enough to carry the motor for a moment to get across non-charging sections. This is the reason for thinking about this, as battery size is one of the critical things when putting RC in a loco. 


Woodies Uncle  :old dude:



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 Posted: Wed Oct 21st, 2009 04:07 pm
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W C Greene
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Good idea, Herb. Once again, I have been "cautioned" by the r/c crowd to isolate the board when charging. While sitting here listening to it rain and watching a "tearjerker" Bonanza show, I realized that since I won't have any "charging track" on my layout, I might be able to make charging easier and achieve the isolation while doing so and also change the on/off switch. When I can get some, I will try a micro DPDT with center off. I will wire the battery output to the center taps, wires to the board on one end and wires to a charging jack on the other end. When the toggle (that's what I want) is centered, the board is off and the battery is TOTALLY isolated from the board. When in charge position, I can use a charging jack perhaps under the loco to juice up the battery. The other position will power the board. There is probably no problem with charging batteries while the board is hooked up but I don't want to fry a board as an experiment.  Maybe one of the resident electrical brainiacs can guide us through this mire of electrons, any takers?

As the "r/c nazi" said-"No pickups for you!"                 Woodie 



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 Posted: Wed Oct 21st, 2009 10:38 pm
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Burra
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Mopman/Woodie:
 Toy-sized infra-red control helicopters and my RC submarine have the (really bad) LiPo charging circuit integrated with the rest of the onboard electronics so it can't be too much of a hazard to the control circuits. I should warn, this is my opinion not verbatim! Those foam choppers are very easy to blow a battery in though :doh:


EBT: proper 4 diode bridge rectifiers work with both AC and DC to ensure you get only the desired polarity output. So you can still take your trains to your friend's DC or DCC layout and have it charge, and not bother about AC on your own layout.

Cheers,
 Mark



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Hi, my name is Mark and I am a trainaholic...
Modelling Tasmanian 2' gauge at the speed of continental drift.
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 Posted: Mon Feb 22nd, 2010 11:27 pm
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HollywoodFoundry
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Burra wrote: Hello all,
 If you come across the new NWSL 'Stanton' Drive, it is the SPUD that the author of the articles this thread is about has designed in conjunction with NWSL, that he uses with his radio control. The units run very well, better than the Hanazono, Tenshodo, PDT and Black Beetle SPUDs in my opinion, and are wired ready to be used with DCC/RCC or what have you.
 I'd link to the NWSL website but its useless. Best I can do is this from my works' blog:
http://bergshobbies.blogspot.com/search/label/Stanton%20Drive
 Cheers,
 Mark


Hmm, Hanazono & Tenshodo are the same, Hanazono make the Tenshodo SPUD. However it is an old design and is showing its age.

When you say the Stanton Drive is better than the Tenshodo SPUD, I would agree, almost anything runs better than a SPUD. To say the Stanton is better than the PDT is a bit odd since the PDT has not been available for 10 years or more.

And comparing the Stanton to the Black Beetle is a little odd also, as the Stanton Drive is not really available to purchase. When, and if it becomes available, it is only offered in 3 wheelbases, no mention of choice in wheel sizes and no price or date of delivery.

So, how did you get one to compare with the SPUD, PDT and Black Beetle?

 

 

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 Posted: Tue Feb 23rd, 2010 12:14 am
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Burra
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Geoff,
 You might know me as Mark K from the ausnarrowgauge yahoo group. I work for Berg's Hobbies, where there has been a sample since the first test units were built.  Berg's is the Oz importer of SPUDs, and the dank dungeon that is the Berg's Hobbies store room occasionally offers treats such as long out of production drives. There is a BB under a loco body kit in the cabinet.
EDIT: BB, SPUD and PDT drives are the closest to the Stanton Drive so why not compare them? /EDIT

Mr Stanton is expected in Sydney in October to demonstrate his RC system on the Berg's Hobbies stand at the annual AMRA exhibition.:rah:

 The big news is, the Stanton Drives are now available. Sold 12 already, only came in last week!

Geoff, I didn't have one of your BullAnts on hand to compare it with, and didn't think to test against your bogie mech. EDIT: I could compare yours to the Stanton next week if you'd like and I remember.  /EDIT

Cheers,
 Mark

Last edited on Tue Feb 23rd, 2010 12:27 am by Burra



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Hi, my name is Mark and I am a trainaholic...
Modelling Tasmanian 2' gauge at the speed of continental drift.
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