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Ed Reutling
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I thought I had done a stroke of business till I saw some y'alls work.
But  I'll  post what I have done anyway.

Self contained Battery & R/C in 'O'-Scale  44-Tonner, in just the hoods.

All the details are   at OGR forum,
and  because I type very poorly and  slowly,
I will take the easy out and  just  fw anyone interested to  what I have done


------------------------


I guess I should post here what I have sorta spread elsewhere
re:  the  ACME  44 tonner that I have self contained R/C

I'll direct you to  2 links  on OGR, to save myself a lot of  retyping.
I really do not like typing  very much.

OGR Threads:

http://ogaugerr.infopop.cc/eve/forums/a/tpc/f/3181048701/m/4842919217   and

http://ogaugerr.infopop.cc/eve/forums/a/tpc/f/3181048701/m/2992927707

 
--------------------------


Regards,

Ed reutling.


Any questions can be directly to me  at   reutling[at]embarqmail


W C Greene
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Ed-that's a great little 44 tonner, I have always loved them even though I am a steam kinda guy. What impresses me also is the great response you got from others in the OGR group, quite different from what I got years ago from On30 groups. Times are changin' and many are now seeing "the light". It is still amazing that the big "manufacturers" won't have anything to do with r/c..shows how backward they really are. Now, send stuff here so we can see it and it can be part of this forum.
Woodie

Ed Reutling
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Woody,

I'll get the parts list and bring it here,
and do I need a web based pix to transfer to this site,
or can I just bring it direct from my hard drive.
I know either way, just a hint should do.

Thx

Ed R


W C Greene
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Ed-just go to the homepage here, click on menu, then click on gallery. You will see upload photos..click on that and browse and click on photos from your computer. Then when you make your post, to add a photo or more, click on the letter G in the reply, click on your photo and there it is...easier to do than to really explain. Try it!
Woodie

Toeffelholm
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Ed,


glad to have another 2.4 GHz user here !

Didn't know your ESC source before,

very interesting.


Juergen


Ed Reutling
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Juergen,


They have older style, designed before Li Po,
which means a person has to have LiPo cut off circuit.
I, being new to R/C, was unaware of that until after discharging below the magic 6 volts of the 7.4 v batteries,
made them unchargable.
A rather expensive lesson.


I will get a few pix on this thread asap.


Ed R


Toeffelholm
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Ed,


The micro ESCs I use are from the 1:87 scale RC-modellers, and have also no battery cut off.


This special ESCs with LiPo cut off - at least the ones that I know - do not really cut the ESC off from the LiPo.
What they do is reducing the voltage when the critical value is near.


So a "normal" RC-modeller recognizes that his model gets slow & knows that it is time to return his model & he has to switch it off.
If you don't do this, the quiescent current will do the rest.


I have been aware of this low-voltage problem since I started with LiPos and so use special Lipo saver circuits,
that give a light or sound signal when voltage is approaching the critical value.
So I'm warned also when the Loco is only standing on the layout.


And nevertheless, I have managed to destroy the one or other LiPo,
just by forgetting to switch the loco off, before leaving the room.


But with Herb's method to use a constant headlight as signal that a loco isn't switched off,
I had no more losses up to now.


Juergen


Ed Reutling
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The  components in the  O Scale 44 tonner hoods


Left hood has the ESC -- the open bare board, and the   Tatic Receiver board.
The  Right hood has a  smaller than usual battery and the  battery eliminator,
which  makes 3.? v constant voltage to power the receiver.
Missing is the  cab floor and the   at the time of the photo, the  battery cut off circuit, which  fits under the floor.


Hope this makes sense.


Ed Reutling


Herb Kephart
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Thanks for the photo, Ed

The more photos that we can show of receiver/battery installations, the better.


Herb  


W C Greene
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Yep, thanks for the photo. One thing that in my r/c ignorance I don't understand is why so many electrical devices? In my locos, I have one board-an ESC/receiver and a battery. With the years I have been doing this, I can just "magically" tell when a battery is getting low. Most times, I just slap a charge on a loco when it may not really need it..the Li Po will let me know by shutting of the charger when it's had enough. Herb's plan of having a headlight connected to the board is the right thing, I still have old timey diode bridge constant loghts with 1.5 volt bulbs. Someday I will change that to Herb's way. I also wonder how much run time is allowed with a small battery that has it's voltage stepped up. Most of my locos have at least 800 MAH 7.4 volt batteries and one Shay has a 1400 MAH 11.1 volt. I get at least 6 to 8 hours of run in these locos. I guess it's dierent strokes......
Woodie

Toeffelholm
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Woodie,


The 'Kyosho' or 'Losi' combined ESC/receiver boards are an exceptional case in the car/boat/plane RC world.
Normally you have a receiver with connections as many as channels and where you plug in your ESC, servo or switching circuit.


I personally need the additional LiPo warner.
I'm just to talented to forget things.
So my scatty factor is just much higher than yours. :)


To the end of the year the 'Kyosho' boards you use, are also available in 2.4 GHz !! :bg:
then also the 2.4 GHz users are able to use this combined boards. :2t:


Juergen


Toeffelholm
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Sorry, I was wrong.


Team Losi 2.4GHz combined boards are available to the end of the year.

http://www.losi.com/Products/Features.aspx?ProdId=LOSB9524


They can be controlled with Spektrum transmitters.
So I'm able to try them.


The combined Kyosho boards are already available for 2.4 GHz

http://www.kyosho.com/eng/products/rc/detail.html?product_no_1=82003

But do only listen to Kyosho 2.4 GHz transmitter.


Juergen


W C Greene
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Juergen-I have been really lucky with what I use, both Kyosho and Losi boards. The Kyosho boards can handle a 3 cell li po but the Losi boards will smoke on 11.1 volts. All my boards/transmitters are the old 27 MHZ AM but they work quite well. I would love to get into 2.4GHZ but the economics won't allow that now. My transmitters are old JR, Kyosho, Traxxas, and a couple of unknown jobs but all work with what I have. If I could afford one, I would try a Stanton system but money is very tight. I prefer the Kyosho boards since their size makes tight installations possible.
Woodie

Nortonville Phil
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Ed,

Great to have you here and doing battery RC.

I converted my first engine a MTH O scale 2-8-0 this past winter.

It ran great.

But I have since removed the RC stuff from that loco and sold the loco to a friend

but kept the RC goodies for another project.


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Woodie,


If your 27Mhz equipment works without appreciable disturbances, there's no need to change.

In my case - after having used different RC controls for my trains over the last 7 years - with 2.4 GHz RC I have absolute disturbance free connection for the first time.

For guys being new to this field like Ed,
it is good to invest in the newer technic, I think.


@Ed,

what PWM frequency does your ESCs have?
Do they give an audible noise?


Juergen


Ed Reutling
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Woodie


This my first experience in R/C.

I had no real outside help, other than Action.com in UK.


They had an ESC which would just fit in the hood of the loco, built before LiPo and had no low voltage cut off.

The receiver has a max of some 3.? volts maximum feed from the battery which I chose as 7.4 volts, because of size.

Therefore I needed a constant voltage device to reduce the 7.4 to 3.? volts to the receiver, there are all the components.


Not having your experience in the LiPo slow down and not knowing that if they are completely discharged,

one can never re-charge them I poofed some $40 + on my lack on knowledge.

Live and learn.


Now, I will ask you for a link to an ESC with LiPo low voltage and built in 3.? volt outlet for the receiver.

At that time I will only have ESC, receiver and battery.

No extraneous parts.


I would like it clean and simple but did the best I could for a first timer,

at least I think so.


Ed Reutling

W C Greene
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Ed-I think you did just right. I was "exposed" to the tiny r/c car stuff when I went to work at a hobby shop that sold them. Previously, the train store where I worked considered my interest in r/c as "devil worship". I didn't know anything like what I have existed until I got to see it for real. Just go to a train shop and tell them that you are interested in r/c..they will be laughing as they throw you out! What I have is an old friend who is a r/c jet flyer, he has taught me quite a lot about radio and encouraged my interest when others thought I was crazy. That's why I always tell others to get a friend who flys, drives, or sails with r/c..they have the best advice.
Woodie

Ed Reutling
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Juergen you said :-

@Ed, what PWM frequency does your ESCs have?

Do they give an audible noise?


Sorry I missed it.


The only audible noise is the motor hums at low starting speed.

Something about the pulse frequency of the ECS, acording to the maker of the board.

It does not really bother me that much, but it is noticeable.



As a change of topic, a modeler had heard of what I have done and asked if he could come by and see what it is all about.

It appears that he is going to try it in one of his locos, a Weaver RS-3.

He was really awed [?] by what he saw !!


Ed Reutling

Toeffelholm
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Hi Ed,


I think I haven't expressed myself clear enough.

Yes, it is the motor that is excited by the PWM frequency.

As you describe it, your ESC seems to have a low frequency like my ESCs from the 1:87 RC car division, that have about 50 Hz.
This, being a frequency in the lowest section of the human audible range.
I notice it as a silent deep toned hum, that doesn't bother me much.

But it goes worse when using an ESC with a frequency at e.g. 1kHz, what seems to be a rather common frequency on many ESCs.
This gives to my experiences an absolutely annoying whistling.

The sound disappears when using a ESC of really high frequency,
that means when it reaches the upper auditory threshold.
I have a very good ESC with 16 KHz that gives no sound at all.


Nowadays DCC decoders also have a very high PWM frequency.
The first DCC decoders I have used on my G-scale locos as they have been rather new to the market,
gave a sound that I thought I destroyed the loco.


Juergen


W C Greene
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Wow-I guess in my "dumb luck", I have missed the high freq noise you mentioned. My old lokies run very nicely and quietly. Go figure...
Woodie


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