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Negativity
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 Posted: Tue Feb 7th, 2017 11:38 pm
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Larry G
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I was recently reminded of some negative comments cast in my direction about 15 years ago. I am curious if things have changed over the years.

This was back when I had first considered modeling in Gn15. It was suggested, by a few, that Gn15 wasn't a worthwhile modeling subject. It couldn't represent a "real" railroad. To these guys a "real" railroad had to have a gauge of 2' or larger and be a common carrier, not a tramway line. In their estimation, tramways were not "real" railroads.

Has anyone else run into this type of negativity in your neck of the woods?

Larry Gant


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 Posted: Wed Feb 8th, 2017 12:00 am
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Lee B
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On30 is still not considered a 'real' gauge by many modelers. In all fairness, it IS a copout to a degree, an attempt to model mostly 3-footers in O scale but with HO track. Many use it as a 'catch all' poor man's On3 and so much whimsical stuff is associated with On30 even still, I guess it's easy to see it as such.
I think only once dedicated On30 track came out did any take it seriously.
Heck, Model Railroader magazine only recently quit calling it On2 1/2 and to this day, doesn't like running articles on it.
To this day, I still get people roll their eyes when I tell them I model in On30, and several have commented after seeing photos of my layout that they expected it to be yet another bastion of shorty cars and whimsical scenes (none of which will ever be on my layout). Once old timer modeler asked me, "If any company had come out with ET&WNC locomotives as good and accurate as the Bachmann ones in On3 instead, would you have gone that gauge instead?" Without hesitation, I said I would have. To that guy, that answer apparently placed me in a more acceptable category for an On30 modeler, for some reason,



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 Posted: Wed Feb 8th, 2017 12:14 am
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W C Greene
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Well then...Back in the dark ages (about 17 years ago), one old fart found that he could put radio control model car equipment in his On30 (another thing!) locos and be able to run them without any of the BS of "traditional" power options. When the locos were shown to other model railroaders, "that's unnatural", "that's silly","what's that got to do with model railroading?"...and other (to him) stupid comments. Even at a "prestigious" narrow gauge meet, the old fart and his buddy were showing a fellow how the r/c locos could run across a concrete floor...two "excellent and cutting edge" narrow gaugers stepped over the running locos and could be heard to say "nuts playing with toy trains!". The r/c guy was even asked to leave a few websites because of his jabber about wireless-ness. Well, look at what we have today...
Those "nay sayers", they are still around, not building anything because they are too busy telling others how THEY should build something. I believe we call them nitpickers or maybe a$$h*&^s today.
Forgive & forget I say, the old fart is happy, his buddies are cool, and the pickers are...still that way!

Woodrow



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 Posted: Wed Feb 8th, 2017 01:05 am
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pipopak
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Has anyone else run into this type of negativity in your neck of the woods?

I have a VERY thick skin... and the ability to retort like the proverbial mother-in-law. Anything else I can help you with?.
Jose.



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 Posted: Wed Feb 8th, 2017 02:48 am
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Larry G
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I too have thick skin and didn't allow the nay-sayers to get under my thick skin. I did wonder why some so called model railroaders, who had never built a layout, were so critical. This is why I asked my original question, here, on this thread.

I was working in G scale, outdoors, 15 years ago. I was having fun and belonged to the Minnesota Garden Railway Club. Changing scales then was not an option.
After retiring and moving to the Black Hills of South Dakota/Wyoming I built the very urban standard gauge layout I had wanted for a long time.

Then, wanting something new to model, I decided to give Gn15 a try. Ever since I was first introduced to Gn15 on Carendt.com I thought Gn15 had the potential to be more than a mini layout.

That is when I decided to build the Appetite Mine layout. So far, I'm having a lot of fun building a "real" tramway line set in the rugged Black Hills.

Larry Gant

Last edited on Wed Feb 8th, 2017 02:58 am by Larry G

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 Posted: Wed Feb 8th, 2017 03:10 am
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Si.
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Hi Larry :wave:


As a kid, I was brought up on the Kent coast part of the time.
My Grandmothers house, had the 'Romney Hythe & Dymchurch Railway' ( RH&DR ) 'mainline' run past the end of her back garden !


It runs to this day, using STEAM as well & a couple of critters.
15" gauge, about 12 miles of mainline, some double-tracked.


It has & I believe still does, run 'school trains' for kids in the mornings.
Operates a VERY busy passenger service during the spring/summer months.
& runs the most amazing small BIG trains you've ever seen.


Check it out on the net.
Laurel & Hardy, who were friends of the original builder, Captain Howe, were at the opening, back in the '20s, if I recall the date right.


:moose:


Si.


P.S. All my HO/OO wheel flanges are too big, so I'm told.

I can't really see that, unless I'm about 6" away & using a magnifying glass though.

Oh well...

...I guess I should 'downgrade' to P4 some day, so everything is 10x more difficult & expensive & derails all the time.

Makes perfect sense, right ? ;)



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 Posted: Wed Feb 8th, 2017 03:37 am
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Larry G
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"On30 is still not considered a 'real' gauge by many modelers. In all fairness, it IS a copout to a degree, an attempt to model mostly 3-footers in O scale but with HO track. Many use it as a 'catch all' poor man's On3 and so much whimsical stuff is associated with On30 even still, I guess it's easy to see it as such."

Just about any gauge you can think of has been used to build a "real" railroad. It seams, to a large part of the model railroad hobby, including MR, that only standard gauge and 3' gauge is worth modeling. Two foot gauge is never covered by MR and 3' is covered very seldom.

Except for the larger scales, steam locos do not run on "real" steam. Few are made of "real" steal and electric locos are the only model locos with the correct drive, electric motors.

Is 5' gauge a cop-out for standard gauge O scale? Most modelers don't think so. In the beginning, G scale was actually modeling 46" gauge and very few gave a care.

All model railroading is a cop-out. We run six car trains with two locomotives on track made with plastic ties. The largest layouts have less than 15 scale miles of track with 8 or 9 towns along that very short track.

This hobby is all about compromises, so why isn't a compromise on track gauge/scale ok?

End of my rant... hope I don't fall getting down off my soap box, Larry Gant


Next, I think I'll start a thread about things that bug me as seen on some layouts.








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 Posted: Wed Feb 8th, 2017 04:04 am
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W C Greene
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Yep, those who gripe the most have not built anything!
Si, since you love the RH&DR, you need an old book that I cherish..."Little Railways of the World" by Fredrick Shaw. It should be available on the cheap, most nitpickers, er..modelers don't know about this one. BTW, it has info on the Gilpin and SCPA&M.

Woodie



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 Posted: Wed Feb 8th, 2017 05:39 am
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mdrailbaron
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Good evening all,  I would like to add my two cents and even though the short answer could get the job done I would like to bore all of you with a somewhat longer answer, you can always stop reading. I have been an On30 modeler for over 40 years and we were the first at least in Maryland to have On30 modules and probably the first to exhibit publicly.  I didn't get any back lash over the years from mine and my fellow modelers modeling, in fact we got a lot of attention and were asked to set up at the Timonium show and else where, including many of the narrow gauge conventions. To us it was truly the best of modeling times. So where is my pet peeve, it is the newbies and other so called experts who think they have invented On30, who think they are "black sheep", that the modeling world is casting them aside, that they can model anything and say this is how it is supposed to be. A friend and former member of my operating group, started a Yahoo On30 group and proclaimed "we don't need any stinking rules"! GIVE ME A BREAK! This is a hobby and it is multifaceted from Z to live steam, narrow, standard, meter, multi gauge it is all good.  Some folks don't even own a train, car, or loco yet they have a deep abiding love for this form of transportation. This is supposed to be fun!  I still have my On30, it fills a 1900 square foot basement, it is point to point, and it actually goes some where, I have an operating group, and we use car cards, train orders, a basic on/off signal system based on a 1880 B&O system, and if that isn't enough we are battery powered radio controlled, even the turnouts are battery powered.   But, it wasn't enough, no the creative juices can't sleep, so I am now building a 3/8n40 point to point, battery powered railroad in an 11' x 25' building and loving every moment.  When I did a search on this scale and gauge for other modelers I couldn't find a one.  Sure, I know about Woodie, and Greg out in the Great Northwest, and have found a few more here and there doing their 3/8n20 and I just love it all.  To me the common threads here are love of trains, love to create, and be damn anyone that doesn't like what you are doing.  I will change what I am modeling when someone comes in the door and pays me to model their way.  I would say, if you give someone else permission to make you feel bad then only you have yourself to blame.  It is just as easy to go out the door you came in, if you don't like what I am doing.  So, I know, over the top but this is an issue that I feel strong about, Gn15, I live in the woods maybe that should be my next consideration....naw to damn hot and humid in the summer, besides it would get in the way of eating steamed crabs and drinking cold beer.  Wishing you all the best, may your tracks be parallel and the trains on time.
Steve FisherMaryland Rail Baron3/8n40 the other large scale just smaller

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 Posted: Wed Feb 8th, 2017 05:41 am
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slateworks
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I think you're right Woodie. I took a bit of flack on NGRM Online over Updah in its early days from a very few individuals, not just because it wasn't a real or copy railway but as much because it was all seat of the pants modelling and imagineering. A small dose of whimsy doesn't seem acceptable to some but it was noticeable that none of the complainers ever showed their own work - if any - on the forum.



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