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Questions On Installing My 'DelTang' R.C. Gear ?
 Moderated by: W C Greene Page:  First Page Previous Page  1  2  3  4  5  6  7  8  9  ...  Next Page Last Page  
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 Posted: Wed Jan 31st, 2018 07:41 pm
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W C Greene
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Something I have written long,long ago (close to 20 years!)...when a buddy & I showed our On30 r/c locos to folks at local hobby shops (one was trains only), we got responses like "nobody wants that" and "that's unnatural". When I talked about using r/c with the local On30 modular group I belonged to-how great it would be to not wire the mods, etc.-I got the idea that they were like the frightened townsfolk coming down the street with torches and pitchforks! That was then, now it is great to read about others embracing the future, even if I don't understand the technical jargon. Keep on keeping on, "the truth is out there!"...

Woodie



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 Posted: Thu Feb 1st, 2018 12:20 am
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dan3192
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Rick,

I understand the difficulties you face as you sort out all the options. Does it seem the more you get into it the more questions come up? That's the way it felt when I started putting together my first engine. I can only assure you it is worth the effort to find the answers and that you will enjoy a new level of satisfaction you would otherwise never achieve.

You will not feel comfortable until you run your BPRC loco for a while. My advice, and especially since you already have many of the parts, is to put an engine together and get some run time.  So mount the 3S battery in the tender, connect the power wires (2) to the DelTang receiver, and mount the end connection of the balance wires (4) on the outside of the tender. Detach the power feed wires from the track to the motor, isolate the motor from the frame (if you can), and connect two new wires from the motor to the tender and receiver, and you are done.

This is obviously an oversimplification, but the point I'm making is it's not that difficult. I suggest making a sketch so you can list the parts you'll need. You can use much lighter wiring from the battery to the receiver and you'll need a 4-wire harness (eBay?) for a balance wire - smart charger connection. Although you have a reed switch, a separate on-off switch ahead of the receiver may still be a good idea. 

I think all of us have experienced a negative, or let's say less than enthusiastic reaction to operating with BPRC engines. It happened to me this past Saturday at the big train show in West Springfield, MA. I signed up for some run time on a layout as I've done 2-3 times before, but this time, the new layout manager assigned me to a secondary spur line instead of the main line. Glad I only took the engine with me, and not the engine plus 10 passenger cars I took with me last year.  

One good thing that came out of the show was an interest in what I'm doing by a major train manufacturer. We talked about using his locomotives, but with my BPRC gear and electronics, to create a dual-function engine. One of the engines I converted was made by his company, plus I let him operate it on his small layout. Time will tell if this goes anywhere.

Bottom line, I hope you follow through and build several locomotives. Your comfort level will rise. And the more people doing this, the more chance of seeing innovating ideas and refinements that move this cab control method into mainstream model railroading.

Dan


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Last edited on Fri Feb 2nd, 2018 10:43 pm by dan3192

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 Posted: Thu Feb 1st, 2018 04:51 am
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Rick Dow
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Thanks Dan. 

I agree that my comfort level will increase when I finally convert that first loco and the darn thing actually runs. Grandsons are coming over Friday for making mountains and a sleepover. It will be a big day for them too, when that first engine finally fires up.

I'm a little intimidated with the idea of soldering wires to a microprocessor and possibly damaging it somehow. I've soldered track and soldered electrical wires on my boat.  Rough stuff though compared to this.

Wiring up the balance chord to do the charging. Still a bit foggy on that too, but working it through my mind. Plus ungrounding the locomotive's motor another new detail I know little about.

In fact I've even hesitating to remove the DCC board from the new tenders. I have six new Bachmann steam locomotives that are DCC equipped waiting in the wings to be converted to battery power. 

When we think of the money invested, it makes becoming a "Wild Thing" with a soldering iron an expensive proposition.  But that day is coming soon. I also have three older DC locomotives with older motors.

Bob R had mentioned that I could use the DTRx62 Receiver instead of my current Rx61 Receivers, the Rx62 having a mounted Reed Switch.

Yesterday I communicated back and forth with Andy Rutter of Micron Radio in England and he assured me that the Reed Switch on the Del Tang (DT) Rx62 Receiver will perform just like a physical, inline ON/OFF Switch. He said that I didn't have to worry about the Charger feeding power past the Reed Switch and damaging the Receiver. 

So earlier today, I placed an order for four Rx62 Receivers with integral Reed Switches to replace my Rx61 Receivers.  The Rx62's will still function fine with my current Tx21 Transmitters.  

So the fact that the Reed Switches will work was good news and saves me having to drill an extra hole in each tender for placement of a physical Off/On switch. This means that I need only cut a hole for the female Balance Switch connection for connection to the Charger.

When you get some time to do so, it would be interesting to hear an explanation of just what electronics you are using  If you've already done that previously within this forum, maybe just list an url for me to go to.

Thanks

Rick

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 Posted: Thu Feb 1st, 2018 05:52 am
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Michael M
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Dan,

I faced a huge learning curve getting into BPRC.  I had many false starts along with several failures, but I still am happy I choose this route.

I've moved to using FlySky components which are pretty bullet proof.  I have two RC locos, and am working on a third.  Each conversion gives me more experience and confidence.

Since my layout is outside BPRC is the only way to go!

Thanks to many people on this site for answering my endless list of questions on how to make things work.




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 Posted: Thu Feb 1st, 2018 07:56 pm
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Toeffelholm
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Rick, 

The reed switch on the Rx62 is not a "switch" in the common sense. It's just a trigger, telling the Rx to open or close connection to supply power. So the reed only closes for the short moment of activation. There is no current passing the reed while running the motor or charging the battery. 

 The Rx62 has further advantages:  

You can comfortably switch the loco off via your Transmitter e.g. using the bind switch.

Rx62 ist able to cut off the board completely from the support voltage.

All DelTang Rx's have a low voltage cut off (LCV), when battery voltage decreases under a certain level (standard setting 3v per cell in case of a Lipo or LiFePo etc), to protect against over discharge (= Lipo exitus). But, except Rx62, in all DT Rx's the LCV feature is "only" able to cut off connection to the electrical loads, not to the board itself. So there is still the low quiescent current, that, slowly but continuously, can over discharge your Lipo if you have forgotten to switch the loco off. (Something that happens to me in the beginning, more than once)


I case of using the protection board, it should care for over discharge protection as well. But as already said, with the balancing protection board you only need a 2pole socket at your loco for charging.



Juergen


Last edited on Thu Feb 1st, 2018 09:03 pm by Toeffelholm



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 Posted: Thu Feb 1st, 2018 08:49 pm
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Bob R
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Rick,
Understand your concerns....I had a few when I started this BPRC stuff.  What I have discovered is all my concerns have been eliminated as I have progressed.
My recommendation to alleviate your initial concerns is - wire up a battery plug to a DelTang receiver voltage in/out contacts, attach motor leads to the receiver, pick an engine to test, attach the motor leads to the engines motor, set a battery on a flat car behind engine and plug in the battery.  All external and all needed to run the engine.  Then just run it for a while.  
I have taken a battery and receiver wired this way to a couple friends and attached to their engines and demonstrated the simplicity of BPRC.  One has started converting his stuff and the other is in process of ordering parts.
Do not be afraid to solder to the tiny little boards.  I use a pretty hot iron with a 3/8 inch wide flat tip and find I can solder without a problem.  I keep telling myself I should buy a pencil tipped one.
As to balance chord wiring...Refer again to the picture I referenced.  If you use a battery protection circuit you do not need to have a balance chord.  Balancing is part of the circuit.  That is why the battery connection to the board is wiring the two cells with the BM connection.  It also eliminates the requirement to wire the receiver for voltage monitoring.  The protection circuits provide over charge/over discharge/and short circuit protection.  As shown in the pictures I posted I use a simple two pin connector to charge.  I use the JST DS 2.0mm Losi type.  They are easy to mount and impossible to plug in backwards.  Another advantage of use of protection circuits is the need for a sophisticated charger is eliminated  (I still like a good one with screen to provide info on charge etc).  You can use a simple 9V wall wart to charge a 2S Lipo.  The circuit will turn off the charge when battery is charged.  I using this type i recommend one with a LED so you can see when the charge has stopped.
Attached picture shows Deltang, Pololu regulator(used because battery is single cell).  The battery plugs into the white connector (actually wired for just to wires) and the Bud boxes cover the battery.  The wires below the chain are the leads to the N gauge Plymouth mechanism.  No switch, no charge jack - just battery to receiver to motor.

Attachment: 299.jpg (Downloaded 59 times)

Last edited on Thu Feb 1st, 2018 08:54 pm by Bob R



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 Posted: Sat Feb 3rd, 2018 07:00 am
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Bob R
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Did another basic installation today in a Bachmann HO F7A.  Consists of a Deltang RX61, 2S 250 mah battery with protection circuit, reed switch and charge jack.  The reed switch is across the rear behind the battery.  The larger red & black wires go to the charge jack mounted behind the fuel tank in front of the rear truck.  It is not noticeable but easily accessed from the side.  I will add lighting as soon as I get to the shop and buy LEDs.

Attachment: 20180202_175305.jpg (Downloaded 42 times)

Last edited on Sat Feb 3rd, 2018 07:03 am by Bob R



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 Posted: Sat Feb 3rd, 2018 07:02 am
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Bob R
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Charge jack mounting.  Once painted it will be nearly invisible.

Attachment: 20180202_175429.jpg (Downloaded 44 times)



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 Posted: Sat Feb 3rd, 2018 08:36 am
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dan3192
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Rick,

There's a lot of good information here. I'll be happy to contribute and explain what I've done. I'll call it "food for thought". Hopefully it helps someone and they can move on to the other issues that need attention. There are many ways to do what we are doing, and everyone has different needs. I can only relate what has worked for me.

For starters, suggest you read how I converted a BLI steamer to battery power and radio control. It's on this forum at Post #685 and here is the link:

http://www.freerails.com/view_topic.php?id=4451&forum_id=45&page=69

The engine has been used at club layouts, conventions and operating sessions for 3 years and for 10 clinics given on this subject. Happy to report it has never failed to operate, or lost a signal on a large club layout, or at big train shows. Unhappy to report it was dropped on its nose (in its box) a couple of weeks ago and will need minor repairs. 

The engine is shown in this YouTube video where I was a guest operator at the South Shore Model RR Club outside of Boston:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4ehNSP34XSI&t=5s

Dan           

Last edited on Sat Feb 3rd, 2018 09:03 am by dan3192

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 Posted: Sat Feb 3rd, 2018 08:57 am
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dan3192
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Michael,

You confirm what we're saying here, try it...you'll like it. 

And you have a great layout there in CA.  Love your Mack Bulldog.

Dan

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